I wish I was going to SPAC, (maybe I am though, not sure yet) but I’ve been to 3 poster shows (Hampton, Red Rocks, and Miami) and I’ve enjoyed each of them. Seen some cool art and purchased a few items that I would have not bought had I not been at the show.
Maaaaaybe I’ll make this my fourth!
I hear what you’re saying about the Poster Show, and I’m for anything that supports the Mockingbird Foundation. I send them a yearly check myself.
But I do have a question about the rest of the products that are being sold on the links on the phanart web page, which is really where you’re getting members of the OKP to go. And that is, are all of the products for sale sanctioned by the band? I’m a firm believer in protecting intellectual property, and if someone is making a hat with the word “Fluff or Fluffhead” on it, then the band should be receiving royalties. If they are not, I agree with Jay, I’d rather not have Phanart use the OKP to help sell those products, in spite of the Poster Show supporting the Mockingbird.
We, as a fan base, enjoy an awful lot of free music at the expense to the band. And even though they allow that to happen with some minor restriction, I personally believe the balance sheet is totally tipped in our favor. To offset that percieved unfairness to the band, I make as many Dry Goods purchases of shirts and recordings from them as I can afford, and in my mind, they still have given me much more than I have paid for. For anyone, ardent fans included, to making a penny more on artwork, apparel or anything else, without kicking a percentage back to the band or to their charities, is something I believe I need to resist.
If you can guarantee that all of the sellers on Phanart are giving the band what they deserve, I’ll be your spokesman on the OKP myself. If you can’t, then I’ll resist your continued promotional attempts here, whether I appear to be behaving like someone on PT or not.
smoky, great to hear! they are awesome shows, and if you’ve been to 3, may as well make it 4.
also, free brunch!
Fone, thats great that you donate to Mockingbird! We seek to increase the amount by making all the items on the blog couple in a donation to Mockingbird. We have raised nearly $2000, all by buying art, plus some auctions and other donations! So thank you and keep it up
As for your question on the products being sold, all of these items are NOT sanctioned by the band. This is not needed, as over the course of creating PhanArt, we retained a lawyer, met with Phish’s lawyers, went over what was and was not ok, and stuck within those guidelines for the book, as well as advised those who take part in the blog what they should and shouldnt use in their art to draw the ire of Phish. We even posted a few notes of this on the blog
phanart.net/blog/?p=983
phanart.net/blog/?p=748
phanart.net/blog/?p=326
While you think the band should be receiving royalties for a Fluffhead hat or shirt, I have to respectfully disagree. For one, the band does not seek to alienate their fans by being greedy over licensing issues. Second, the word ‘fluffhead’ is not trademarkable, not could it be copyrighted. It is a word and it is Fair Use (per the copyright act) to be used in this instance.
Now if you put the word Fluffhead inside the Phish Logo, you are asking for trouble. The logo is a copyrighted design and has protections. Words like Fluffhead, Simple, Jibboo or Maze do not.
So if the band makes money, then the poster show is ok to keep on this website? If Trey isnt making a buck a shirt, then its not ok? did this website become Phish Inc. property?
Yes, the balance is in our favor. The boys come out, play 2 and a half hours and then go on the road to the next place. We get a GREAT deal. should we be leveling the playing field? no. That would make Phish Dave Matthews Band. Thats not what we want to turn into.
If you want to buy goods from Dry Goods, that is fine. I choose to buy something from them every so often, but to expect fans to chip in more than we already do is an unfair statement.
You dont like fans making money on art or anything, how do you think the community is able to make it from show to show, to fund their tour? this is the equivalent of a bazaar or open marketplace that travels with the band. Avoid the logo, the word Phish and the likeness of the band members, and you’re fine. Everything else is fairgame, and even Phish admits that much.
Heck, they even have the legal precedent from this from a court case in the late 1990s. Its not harming anyone to make a shirt that says YEM in the IBM logo. Not the band, or anyone. In fact, Trey and the others have worn lot-art/phanart on stage during shows. I’m pretty sure they werent worried about kickbacks for the chance to be creative, sell a shirt, and make a few bucks that will go to gas, tickets, etc…
On that note, what if the shirt or art someone made was used SOLELY to pay to see Phish? Is that ok? they are using the money in this case to go directly into the show, and then sell some shirts or art because they want to see the band. Its a tough economy, so if you have a talent and can make some art, I say do it.
I can guarantee you that no one on the blog is sending a check to Phish, Phish Inc, JEMP, Red Light, Music Today, or anyone affiliated with the band. This is a fan based thing. We are within legal boundaries here. I’m sorry we dont see eye to eye, but promoting an art show where fans can check out some great art and raise some funds for Mockingbird is well worth it.
You can resist promotional attempts, but thats not what it is all about. Just ignore any topics like this.
And stop by and say hi in the lot, i do like to hear the other side of things like this. But i cant see why we should give the band a cut of what we make, when they dont have a problem with us selling art.
^It’s nice to see that you’ve had the lawyers meet eye to eye. Does my soul good to know that on the perimeter of an experience that approaches the spiritual for me, the money lenders are parked outside the temple. I apologize for being so myopic about your endeavors and those of the artists and merchandisers who seek to sell their work on phanart, but Shakedown St does bother me, in spite of the efforts of some fans to support their tour expenses. But the sellers and merchandiers at concerts have always been a negative influence in my mind, even if they provide some services for some fans and support themselves in the process. I like to believe no one is becoming a corporate entity off hawking things at Phish concerts, but the introduction of commercialism into the community defeats one of motivations that I attend Phish concerts in the first place, ie, to get away from those realities, if only for a couple of hours.
Look what that same spirit of free market has done to the price and availability of even getting to a Phish show. Phish Inc has always tried to keep the price for their shows at a reasonably low level, especially so in the light of guy like Roger Waters who wants anywhere from 78 to 258 bucks to see his show this Fall in Philadelphia. I can almost understand the rationale since he’s probably determined to prevent the “open market” from making money off of his efforts through the online scalping business.
I’m sorry, but whether or not your artisan group is within its legal boundaries to produce products based upon the words, images and spirit of the songs of Phish, that attach a strong emotional bond to those icons, I’m insulted by the marketplaces intrusion into my experience. I accept it as part of the price of admission, but I resist it as something that diminishes the shows and the music for me.
Fortunately for your sake, there are people who enjoy having a wide range of products and services at concerts, and I endorse their right to accept what you offer, as I do your belief that you are doing something worthwhile for them while still making a buck for yourself. Hey, it’s the Amurikan way.
RETRACT!!! 
Shakedown is a way of life and has been for the last few thousand years. People have always gathered near saint shrines, mosques, temples, churches, and sold things that could be marketed and sold by the location they are near. But they dont because thats bad for business, simple as that. If the catholic church put up an official vending location at every single church, monastery, and saint shrine in Europe alone, AND kept people from selling their own creations, it would be bad for business and turn people off
can you tell i researched that one? wrote a big essay on it for the book 
“But the sellers and merchandiers at concerts have always been a negative influence in my mind”
how is this negative? do we only have to support the band? why not the fans supporting each other? Phish makes millions of dollars off of ticket sales, do they need our merch and food and beer money too?
“the introduction of commercialism into the community defeats one of motivations that I attend Phish concerts in the first place, ie, to get away from those realities, if only for a couple of hours.”
you can take the person out of the commercialism, but you cant take the commercialism out of the community. its an unbreakable cycle, simple as that.
Roger Waters vs. Phish is a good point, but you forget that Waters doesnt tour like Phish does, he’s old, and the fanbase is scattered. Phish’s fanbase is intact and growing. keeping tickets at $50 (before fees) is a marketing decision.
If you dont like the marketplace’s ‘intrusion into (your) experience’ than simply park in the VIP lot, walk right into the show, and ignore all of us who are trying to make it from show to show. you dont have to like it, but being respectful of those who choose to do this is polite as well.
If you saw it from the bigger picture, you would see it as something that adds to the show, rather than diminishes it.
you make some valid points, but i have to ask - how long have you been on tour to have this cynical a view of the lot scene? i dont ask rudely, just as a point of fact
retract what?
If you and the Phish inc. lawyers have worked out what is and is not allowed, I have no ground to say anything negative…
Enjoy summer tour and I will be stopping by to check out as much as I can and like every year we will be donating to the Mockingbird as well! Great cause and more people whould make sure they drop a few bucks off to that table during the summer!
Thanks for giving us the info, I see nothing wrong with what you posted but I am normally drilled for stuff anyhow, so do not take anything I say for much more than words on the screen! 
thanks phishinsky, much appreciated. to others, not exactly sure how i came off as pompous, but to each his own. just trying to raise money for mockingbird and making some cool art in the process, as well as exposing cool art in the process!
I think the original point was that most of your posts are advertising, whether it’s for a good cause or not. Take the book trading thread. Some guys are trying to set up a book trading circle, and rather than join the discussion, you plug a product. I think that you should limit your Phanart posts to the Oh Kee Bay section of the board if that’s your main purpose here. If someone wants to buy something, they’ll find your endless stream of commercials there.
Are there pics of the art?. or am I just missing them…
i think you missing the point here. its a poster show, with art for sale to benefit the Mockingbird Foundation. There is art on display and for sale. its a unique experience, and FOR FREE. no charge, no money expected. its inviting the community to attend
The Phish community is welcoming to an art show and expressions of their love for the band. asking that a posting like this be relegated to another forum is overstepping. Its letting fans know about an event, not asking for money or anything else
goldphish, check out the artists via their websites or expressobeans. if you want links, i can provide those.
as for the book trading circle, its a book thread, about Phish. how does the book not fit in there? seems common sense. if they want to trade it, by all means, but its worth throwing out there
I’m not missing the point. 90% of your posts are advertisements, plain and simple. You’re not sharing you’re thoughts on Phish, you’re selling goods. Sell your goods in the section designated for selling goods.
90%? really?
you are missing the point, its for charity and its part of the Phish community. sorry you arent digging it.
exactly WHAT am i selling in this thread? i see no paypal links, $$ amounts or requests to buy anything. its a stretch to say im selling stuff
anything else goes in the ‘got something to sell’ page, and that i am well aware of.
i share my thoughts on Phish from time to time, but raising money for Mockingbird is the stated goal and mission of the website and i focus on that.
want my thoughts on Phish? happy to share them with ya, as always
This thread is the ten percent not selling something. Everything just happened to boil up here.
::hijacks thread::
do you think light is going to be toned down a little bit more this summer in favor of bigger stealing time’s and/or KDF’s? i do, what do ya think?
yeah post some links or a few of your favorite pictures… in 04’ somebody gave me a print of… well it was trey and some fish and it was split like a mirror… it was really cool. The next show I gave it to someone else so they could have something cool like that given to them. it was nifty difty! 
I can understand peoples deriding spirit about the commercialism but I don’t mind. Artists have to make a living too and you have the charity angle so thats a feel good thing. I do understand that the people who have the talent to make art deserve something for their efforts. but… you know… artists can sometimes be annoying 
… like because you can paint the most beautiful pen15 ever that makes you special or something you arty farty lol ikidikid
two words: Pen Island